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Thread: Safe oil for lube.

  1. #1
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    Safe oil for lube.

    I have 2 lubricants in my garage and I am wondering if either are ok to lube my M4-117 with?

    I have WD40 and CLP

    I use CLP on real rifles, however the Crossman site said no petroleum based lubricants and I do not know if either of these lubes are petroleum based.

    Thanks all.

  2. #2
    There are some guys here who really know there stuff and they will get to you soon.... However, Do not use either until someone gives you the Oki Doki. I really chickened out and only use the Crosman brand Pelgun oil and Silicone Chamber lube. There is something about the seals going bad under the solvent nature of petroleum based products.
    On a side note, and there are those that know more than I do, I am pretty sure that WD40 is a Water Displacer more than a lubricant... Or, that is what I heard it was preliminarily designed for... Maybe...

  3. #3
    Senior Member SeanMP's Avatar
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    Hi Pharoah

    I would not use either but not for any reason you may guess.

    Firstly WD40 is not a lubricant in the normal sense. It has minor lubricating properties but it is meant as a water displacement ie WD. Beyond that it is almost pure solvent carrier. Really not what your after.

    CLP Cleaner Lubricant Protectant is teflon and a nitro solvent in a carrier...again not what your really looking for.

    Pure silicone lubricant sold as chamber lube or silicone oil is always the safest bet. Or Synthetic #1 sewing machine oil. Neither of these will gum or more importantly combust in an HPA....and a pumper is an HPA and trust me I can make the wrong lubricant detonate in a pumper. Especially sprays that use butane or propane as the propellant....it's rather exciting having the pump fly out of your hand with a jolt.
    Sean

  4. #4
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    thanks guys.

    I do have spray silicone lube.

    Could I coat a q tip in this silicone and use safely until I get some of the correct lube?

  5. #5
    Administrator AirGunEric's Avatar
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    This is not a PCP or springer- so you could use a plain 3-in-1 oil- "petroleum base" means nothing in respect to Co2 and Pumpers- this is just people repeating old junk they "heard" and have only repeated. Manufacturers oils- i.e. Pellgunoil and such is petroleum based. Silicone you can use, but it is really only required on/in a PCP or springer. Keep in mind that on mechanical joints- i.e. the pivot on a break-barrel, you would use a regular oil as well- not silicone. Silicone or a petroleum lube would be fine on you M4-177 pumper.
    I'd say I care- but I'd probably be lying...


  6. #6
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    Thanks. Silicone it is until I order some parts and throw in some Crosman lube.

  7. #7
    Moderator rsterne's Avatar
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    Hadn't really thought about it, my pumper days were pre-PCP when I never thought about HPA and oil.... I used to use pellgun oil, even on the pump cup, just a drop now and then.... I never had any problem, but I'd never even consider using it on a PCP, and pumpers can run up to 1500 psi, so the safe bet would be a pure Silicone oil on the pump cup, although you could in theory use pellgun oil on the pivots.... Problem is, oil can migrate if a gun is stored in certain orientations, and that drop you put on the pivot might just end up in the pump tube....

    Again, I've never had a problem, but from now on I'm going to use a Silicone lube on my pumpers.... Better safe than sorry, I guess.... What do Crosman recommend, Eric?....

    Bob
    Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
    Airsonal:
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  8. #8
    Administrator AirGunEric's Avatar
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    Pellgunoil- i.e. petroleum lube. Keep in mind they've been selling Pellgunoil for 30+ years, long before they ever considered getting into the PCP lineup, for use on all their Co2 and pump-up guns. I would suggest that the flash point of pellgunoil (basically thin oil- i.e. SAE-5 or so) is either higher than 1500*, or that whatever the flash point, it cannot be generated in a typical pumper- i.e. no one can pump rapidly enough to approach the PCP pressure change rate that would generate the sort of heat required. That being said- one of your "uber pumpers" might (?) be a different story.
    I'd say I care- but I'd probably be lying...


  9. #9
    Moderator rsterne's Avatar
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    I thought that was their recommendation.... I wonder if the Delrin piston I melted was partially due to oil combustion?.... Probably not, I never noticed any "kick" while pumping, which would be the first symptom I would think.... I see Sean has experienced it, though.... Like I said, never considered it before.... With the large headspace from the rubber cups in Crosman guns they probably can't develop enough heat and pressure.... With a flat-topped piston and rapid pumping and lots of pumps?.... I wonder.... hmmmmmmmmm....

    Bob
    Dominion Marksman Silver Shield - 5890 x 6000 in 1976, and downhill ever since!
    Airsonal:
    .177 Diana 34, 1750 CO2 Carbine, .177 Uber-Pumper, .22 Uber-Carbine, .25 Discovery, 22XX PCP 8-shot Carbine, 2260 PCP Rifle (50 FPE), Hayabusa PCP, .22 B-26, DAQ .308 Exile

  10. #10
    Administrator AirGunEric's Avatar
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    I think if someone tries hard enough, they can make anything not outside the realm of reality occur. That being said, short of pumping with an FTP 50+ times rapidly, I think igniting a petroleum-based lube in a typical off-the-shelf pumper, even modified is not too likely.

    There are always stories of people having done something- i.e. the melted delrin pistons or igniting a petroleum lube in a pumper- but these are usually at the extreme ends of the concept- i.e. 50 pumps, or 50+ pumps with a metal piston- not where 99.9% of people are going to find themselves generally. If the concept is to "break the box"- this can always be achieved- but should it mean everyone should conduct themselves in a regular day-to-day setting in a manner orienting at addressing a break-the-box scenario? Not really. If someone is going to test "extremes" then I would agree they should use the best materials for the job, but for Joe and Fred who are not attempting to test the extremes, or even come near approaching them, this is not a requirement.

    I think what we are having here is a back-forth of "extreme engineering" vs. "common use"- which if we take it too far means no one leaves their house in the morning without putting on an armoured, anti-UV radiation suit.
    I'd say I care- but I'd probably be lying...


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